um, this? IS NOT FAT

[seldear]

Okay, I have a rant.

The Body Beautiful: a fashion photoshoot with "plus-size" models.

Some of the comments fill me with rage. People are going on about how these women are overweight, obese, unhealthy... It really says quite a lot about how the fashion industry has twisted our perceptions of female size. These women are not fat. They are not even obese (unless you go by the BMI, and darlings, according to the BMI I am obese). They are curvy, with hips and breasts and waists. Yes, they are a "plus" size (probably US 12-14), but that is not the same as "unhealthy".

Incidentally, a waif-thin model is just as capable of being unhealthy as one of these women. Just. As. Capable.

*grr*

Comments

[anjak-j.livejournal.com]

I didn't read any of the comments on that because I just knew they'd be full of that kind of stupidity.

It's just sad that people think that the ideal way to look is size zero, with bones sticking out everywhere. The models aren't even "plus" size - they're just average woman size.

[seldearslj.livejournal.com]

The comments are just so full of fail, it boggles me.

[seldearslj.livejournal.com]

The models aren't even "plus" size - they're just average woman size.

Hence my use of the quotation marks every time I spoke about "plus sizes". It's crazy.

Even skinny can be extremely unhealthy. Sure, some people are naturally skinny...and some people are naturally slightly larger than a twig. *shakes head*

It's ridiculous and stupid.

[skydiver119.livejournal.com]

if you wanna get right down to it the size 0 and 00's that are models are usually far less healthy than the 'obese' size 8's and 10's

[seldearslj.livejournal.com]

Exactly!

[jadestrick.livejournal.com]

I didn't WANT to read the comments.

But I will say that those girls are effing HOT. They're completely confident ('specially the one laying on the floor) and that is sexy as hell.

[seldearslj.livejournal.com]

I found this link while looking through a Wank Of Fail regarding this dating site that apparently votes people in based on whether they're hot or not.

Apparently, during Thanksgiving-Christmas, a whole bunch of their members went and put on a few pounds from the eating. They got voted off the island, because they let themselves go and were now no longer 'hot' or 'beautiful'.

So much fail, I don't even know where to begin!

[jadestrick.livejournal.com]

I seriously do not understand people who react like that. Really now, WHO RAISED THEM?

[wojelah.livejournal.com]

Amen.

[seldearslj.livejournal.com]

The witch-hunt for obesity is growing ridiculous.

Any roll of fat is evil! EVIL, I TELL YOU!

[seldearslj.livejournal.com]

I wasn't pointing out that the women in the shoot are necessarily healthy so much as that they are not necessarily unhealthy - and that they're not 'fat'. The comments I noticed were those that leapt on the "these women are not 'average or under-size' therefore they must be obese" wagon and "this display of obesity is only promoting unhealthiness!"

Truly I haven't seen your mother in a while (that I remember) so I'm a bit fuzzy on her size. But, I agree that that sizes 16-plus aren't always healthy ones.

However, there's a size-of-physical-frame issue here as well though. If you or I were size 16+ then there's certainly an argument for unhealthyness - our frames are smaller, not built on a big scale. We're not meant to be 16+.

On the other hand, I know women who are built bigger - not just taller, but wider across the hips, deeper in the chest, broader in the shoulders. They're not going to fit into anything less than a size 16-18 Australian. They are quite literally 'large women' and the fact that they are the clothing size they are is less to do with their weight or curves and more to do with the size of their frame.

For the most part, the women in the shoot seemed on the curvy side of things, but otherwise well-sized for their bone structure. They might be healthy, they might not be. But my call is that they don't deserve the censure heaped upon them by a lot of the commenters on the article who use the terms 'obese' and 'fat' to describe them.

Ideally, we'd get healthy-looking women in all the major sizes (Australian 6-16) in magazines and on the catwalks - it would be nice.

[seldearslj.livejournal.com]

I had no idea about that article - thanks for the link. Definitely some good points there. I'm a little afraid to read the comments there, too, though. I've noticed that a lot of comments in the linked beauty-obesity-health discussion become a) a question of personal preference for guys to dictate what a woman should look like to be found attractive by the (male) commenter in question, b) a defense of the (female) poster's lifestyle and/or body size and shape.

It is interesting that we (society) are using the term 'real' to mean 'not-skinny', when naturally skinny women are perfectly real, too. And the author has a point when she says that co-opting the question of "real" vs. "unreal" is unhelpful to a feminist dialogue: the question isn't "what is a real woman?" but "how can we encourage women to be happy and healthy with their bodies - whatever size and shape they happen to be?"

There's a whole lot of stuff in there about the conflation of 'large' with 'unhealthy', but it's past midnight and I should get a little sleep before the sun comes up... :)

[meg-pat2000.livejournal.com]

It cracks me up that they are considered "unhealthy"

What annoys me sooooo very much, and i see it all the time- is that people assume if your a size 16-20 all you do is eat maccas all day and watch telly consumining inordinates amount of food.

I am a size 16-18.

I can run 4km, I box 3 nights a week, I can run up 10 flights of stairs, I can bench press 80kgs, I can leg press 380kgs, I can swim 5kms. I run with tires tied around me, i carry logs and snagbags whilst running, i sprint in the sand. I have a cholesterol level that is almost non-existant, my blood pressure is perfect. In fact I am healthier than alot of "skinny" people I know who get dead tired after 2 flights of stairs. It just so happens that I have a diseases that causes my body to latch on to adipose fatty tissue and not let it go, and cannot process some foods correctly - I kill myself 6 days/nights a week and i lose NUTHING!!! But I am considered medically "morbidly obese" yet my bloodwork is perfect.

It really gets me irrate.

/rant

an personally i think these girls are beautiful!

[seldearslj.livejournal.com]

See, that's the thing about healthy - it's not necessarily related to weight or shape.

There are women I play hockey against who can run rings around me, and they're shorter and rounder than I am. I don't know their physical health - blood pressure, cholesterol, etc., but they can damn sure run!

So, yeah.

There's this whole conflation of "beautiful" with "healthy" with "slim" - the words are often used interchangeably, and where they're not, they're understood to be more or less synonymous. Which is wrong.

[ninjoo.livejournal.com]

They're gorgeous and a lot healthier than many runway models out there. The ignorance in the comments made me sad, though. But, *grabs another coke and some chocolate*, I am loving my muffin tops a lot more because of this photo shoot :D

[seldearslj.livejournal.com]

I think the thing is that a lot of the commenters are conflating 'skinny' with 'healthy'. Since these women are not skinny, they can't be healthy...which isn't the point of the shoot. The point of the shoot is to say "bigger women can be beautiful too". Healthy does not come into it at all.

The skinny-fat scale is distinct from the healthy-unhealthy scale. I know a 44 year-old woman who's small, wiry, can outrun our entire hockey team, and is healthy as a horse. My fried in the comment above, meg_pat2000 is short and very round, but she's healthier than I am.

These women have figures that are closer to normal, they look beautiful and gorgeous. Are they healthy? We can't make that call - and never can in something that's merely a photoshoot.

Are these women obese or fat? Hell, no. Are they beautiful? Hell, yes! Should we strive to be healthy, whether or not we are large or small size, beautiful or plain? Hell, yes!

I'm glad to see a greater variety of models in fashion shoots, but for me, the photoshoot is about image, self-confidence, and beauty.

Good living and health is another issue entirely and should be aimed for by everyone no matter what their physical size.

[wiliqueen.livejournal.com]

There are comments? Sorry, I was too busy going "guh."

< /facetious >

Right there with you, m'dear. There is so much stupid out there, I can't even begin.